Curse

DarkSpirit · May 08, 2008, 08:28 PM // 20:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by - Tain -

Nope, not dreaming. If you're running hench monks with this, the prot hench has PS so you don't need it cluttering up your orders. If you have a friend with heroes, have them run a decent build so you don't need it cluttering up your orders.

I prefer to H/H most of the time. And I hate to bring Lina (aka Miss Wammo) if I can help it, Mhenlo is usually enough for my hench monk needs. The rest of the hench slots are for damage.

- Tain - · May 08, 2008, 08:34 PM // 20:34

I do the same.. and you really, really don't need PS. Not only are the attributes wasted that could be used on something effective, heroes aren't even good with it - they like to spam it at the first sign of damage, regardless of amount. So why waste the atts and micro a skill you don't need? Unless you're going into an area with a substantial amount of armor-ignoring damage, it's just that - a waste.

Edit: If you want to add something defensive onto the bar, go ahead. But the prot is not your best option. I'd go with hex removal (SS, Blurred Vision, Soothing Images, Faintheartedness, etc. all screw with your imba), or wards/blind/weakness. The better option, imo, is to lean more offensively. It's not like you don't have overpowered defense or predictable enemies, and dead things won't hurt you either.

DarkSpirit · May 08, 2008, 08:38 PM // 20:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by - Tain -

I do the same.. and you really, really don't need PS. Not only are the attributes wasted that could be used on something effective, heroes aren't even good with it - they like to spam it at the first sign of damage, regardless of amount. So why waste the atts and micro a skill you don't need? Unless you're going into an area with a substantial amount of armor-ignoring damage, it's just that - a waste.

I dont see them spamming it at the first sign of damage. I see them using it when the life of an ally is low.

Heroes do work with PS. Check out Sabway.

Tyla · May 08, 2008, 08:43 PM // 20:43

That's because PS is supposed to be used on the first sign of damage. Only if it's huge damage though.

When an ally is low on health, that ally needs healing, maybe an RoF aswell for safety.

- Tain - · May 08, 2008, 08:45 PM // 20:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Heroes do work with PS. Check out Sabway.

Sabway runs with minions which fuel SR which lets them spam things. Like PS. And Sabway doesn't have an imba.

And yes, PS is supposed to be used at the first sign of large damage, not a wanding enemy monk (it happens).

Edit: Please defend why aegis/PS is a better choice than other things, rather than spamming the thread with stubborn ignorance.

legacyofkain85 · May 08, 2008, 09:27 PM // 21:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Are we talking about Rac's build on this thread? He doesn't have a monk build to fix, besides Mhenlo and possibly Lina. You must be dreaming of some other hero team build and gone OT.

mhenlo and lina are more than enough to keep u alive if u keep the team alive with your tntf+sy chain

DarkSpirit · May 08, 2008, 10:40 PM // 22:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by - Tain -

Sabway runs with minions which fuel SR which lets them spam things. Like PS. And Sabway doesn't have an imba.

But the point you were making is, that heroes dont even use PS right. You said:-

Quote:

Originally Posted by - Tain -

heroes aren't even good with it - they like to spam it at the first sign of damage, regardless of amount. So why waste the atts and micro a skill you don't need? Unless you're going into an area with a substantial amount of armor-ignoring damage, it's just that - a waste.

I still dont see why imbagons who are not affected by their own SY would have no use for any protection at all. What would you recommend?

Quote:

Originally Posted by legacyofkain85

mhenlo and lina are more than enough to keep u alive if u keep the team alive with your tntf+sy chain

Like I have said, I dont wish to bring Lina if I can help it. The reason why I brought PS on my hero is so that I dont need to bring Lina in the first place.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

That's because PS is supposed to be used on the first sign of damage. Only if it's huge damage though.

When an ally is low on health, that ally needs healing, maybe an RoF aswell for safety.

That kind of makes sense. I was considering bringing RoF instead.

- Tain - · May 09, 2008, 12:05 AM // 00:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

But the point you were making is, that heroes dont even use PS right. You said:-

I also said this:

Quote:

Originally Posted by - Tain -

And yes, PS is supposed to be used at the first sign of large damage, not a wanding enemy monk (it happens).

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

I still dont see why imbagons who are not affected by their own SY would have no use for any protection at all. What would you recommend?

If you really want to use prot, go with small prots - SoA and Guardian are effective and efficient when enemies focus fire (most of the time). But, I also said this:

Quote:

Originally Posted by - Tain -

But the prot is not your best option. I'd go with hex removal (SS, Blurred Vision, Soothing Images, Faintheartedness, etc. all screw with your imba), or wards/blind/weakness.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Like I have said, I dont wish to bring Lina if I can help it. The reason why I brought PS on my hero is so that I dont need to bring Lina in the first place.

I also don't like to bring her if I don't have to. As well as the defensive options I listed above, the paragons are flexible and can handle a skill switch here and there. Angelic Bond if you find you're being spiked out, or something simple like Finale of Restoration if it's just pressure. Etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

That kind of makes sense. I was considering bringing RoF instead.

RoF is excellent for a human monk - very useful if someone is low, you can RoF before the WoH to make sure you don't lose them during the 3/4s cast. I've found heroes tend to spam it, which is fine on a healer but would distract the orders from his job too much.

DarkSpirit · May 09, 2008, 12:13 AM // 00:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by - Tain -

RoF is excellent for a human monk - very useful if someone is low, you can RoF before the WoH to make sure you don't lose them during the 3/4s cast. I've found heroes tend to spam it, which is fine on a healer but would distract the orders from his job too much.

That was what I saw from the D/N hero too, healing herself or kiting too much rather than casting her orders.

I dont know if they would overspam RoF but I have seen RoF works on monk heroes before. I would have to try it out.

FyrFytr998 · May 09, 2008, 01:50 AM // 01:50

Okay, right off the bat I will fess up that I have ZERO wiki skills.

Isn't it about time Racway was put up on PvX Wiki?

I think it's deserving, based on all the positive responses, to get an article going.

Racthoh · May 09, 2008, 01:52 AM // 01:52

I hate trying to write things on PvX.

FyrFytr998 · May 09, 2008, 01:55 AM // 01:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

I hate trying to write things on PvX.

Lol, well, at least you're honest.

Coloneh · May 09, 2008, 02:41 AM // 02:41

anything on PvX gets modified by unmoderated idiots until its totally useless. best not to bother. we have the template codes and everything here.

Bront · May 09, 2008, 02:54 AM // 02:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Nice. I was thinking of something like this:

[build prof=N/Mo box name="Orders Support" blo=12+1+3 sou=9+1 pro=9][Signet of Removal][Order of Pain][Dark Fury][Masochism][Protective Spirit][Aegis][Vengeance][Signet of Lost Souls][/build]

...or alteratively, replace vengeance with a heal like Blood Renewal.

I'd replace Prot Spirit with Extinguish for a party wide condition removal. Heroes tend to use that better than Prot Spirit anyway, and as others have said, you have lots of protection.

Aegis isn't bad, it protects the human paragon, and is a backup in case there's a break in SY and/or TNTF

- Tain - · May 09, 2008, 03:37 AM // 03:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

anything on PvX gets modified by unmoderated idiots until its totally useless. best not to bother. we have the template codes and everything here.

QFT. No reason to, and too much hassle.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bront

I'd replace Prot Spirit with Extinguish for a party wide condition removal. Heroes tend to use that better than Prot Spirit anyway, and as others have said, you have lots of protection.

Aegis isn't bad, it protects the human paragon, and is a backup in case there's a break in SY and/or TNTF

You realize that he'll use Extinguish to remove Cracked Armor, if that's the only condition removal on him. And small prots (guardian/soa) will do better than aegis for the most part.

DarkSpirit · May 09, 2008, 03:52 AM // 03:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bront

I'd replace Prot Spirit with Extinguish for a party wide condition removal. Heroes tend to use that better than Prot Spirit anyway, and as others have said, you have lots of protection.

Aegis isn't bad, it protects the human paragon, and is a backup in case there's a break in SY and/or TNTF

There is no need for Extinguish when you already have Signet of Removal.

Heroes cast protective spirit just fine from my own observations despite what was said, but short duration enchantments like RoF, SoA and Patient Spirit would benefit my Pious Renewal build better.

Bront · May 09, 2008, 04:48 AM // 04:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

There is no need for Extinguish when you already have Signet of Removal.

Heroes cast protective spirit just fine from my own observations despite what was said, but short duration enchantments like RoF, SoA and Patient Spirit would benefit my Pious Renewal build better.

Patient Spirit is heal, so RoF, SoA, and Shielding Hands might work better, and also work well instead of PS or Extinguish.

My knowledge on Extinguish is more general use (which I've seen used fairly well) than anything else.

DarkSpirit · May 09, 2008, 05:15 AM // 05:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bront

Patient Spirit is heal, so RoF, SoA, and Shielding Hands might work better, and also work well instead of PS or Extinguish.

My knowledge on Extinguish is more general use (which I've seen used fairly well) than anything else.

I would consider shielding hands. I prefer Signet of Removal to Extinguish as it removes hex as well, at very low recharge, 0e.

Bront · May 09, 2008, 06:43 AM // 06:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

I would consider shielding hands. I prefer Signet of Removal to Extinguish as it removes hex as well, at very low recharge, 0e.

If you don't need the Elite spot for something else (which you don't) then it makes sense.

DarkSpirit · May 09, 2008, 07:06 AM // 07:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bront

If you don't need the Elite spot for something else (which you don't) then it makes sense.

Signet of Removal is good for a secondary monk in an orders group for hex and condition removal and worth its elite spot.